Judy Holtzer (Knopf)

Hi everyone. Here is the View from Abroad on the Matter of the Decline of the English Language....

I am much like Janus on this topic, since although I worked as an English editor (mostly English medical editing) at Ben Gurion University for many years in several departments, I have still lived in a non-English-speaking country for 50 years so that when speaking, at times I will recall the Hebrew word rather than the English one when speaking English, and the English word rather than the Hebrew when speaking Hebrew. However, this is a topic that engages my attention, since I have always loved English, so here goes.

It's often painful listening to English-speaking TV programs. Downton Abbey may have been marvelous for the attention to dress, food and whatnot appropriate for the period, but I seriously doubt if the now-popular phrase "reach out" was used in 1920 in upper-class Britain. There were other anachronisms of speech made that made me blink rapidly, but I cannot recall them just now. Confessing that I watch the Property Brothers Drew and Jonathan Scott is difficult for me, but I need to comment that I want to scream every time I hear the words "massive" and "tons of storage" falling from the brothers' lips, since they seem quite well-educated and voluble for their age. In general and among the masses on TV, "amazing" and "awesome" set my teeth on edge. Get these people a Thesaurus!

When I shop online at Ebay and get messages from the seller, I am often completely perplexed. Recently, there was a very nice lady from the UK who wrote incomprehensible messages, but I have encountered many others from the States who were equally hard to understand. 

Now comes to mind the much-published cardiologist in the department where I edited papers before they were submitted to medical journals. Before I continue, I have to explain that Israelis are quite geographically discriminatory in nature automatically, even after knowing a person for years. In this case, the Much-Published One was from an elite area of Tel Aviv, while I was a lowly resident of Beer Sheva. He wrote about an experiment in which tissue was grown "ex vivo". Excuse me? "Ex vivo"? What does that mean? It could be said that it has so many meanings as to have no meaning at all. I earnestly attempted to use logic with him to explain just this point, but logic with a snobbish physician is a lost cause. He showed me a previous paper where another scientist had gotten away with using "ex vivo" in a paper that was published in the same journal to which he was submitting, so logic flitted out the window.

Please pardon my passion (not to mention the alliteration). The cardiological assault took place nearly twenty years ago, but still rankles. I dare not dwell on what this divulges about me, including the urge toward alliteration.

I must share the good news I got from the pet hospital just now. My 16 year old puppy who has been my primary companion since he was 3 months old was diagnosed with pancreatitis, and not mestatasis of the adrenal invasive cancer diagnosed some months ago. The cancer is inoperable at his age, so when he suddenly could not get up or walk on his own, and seemed to be failing in front of me, I thought that this was it. I am so thrilled that the vet thinks that they can treat the pancreatitis and resulting pain, and that he can have at least a few more fairly comfortable months that I had to share. BG is a mostly terrier mutt, and the smartest, most playful dog I have ever had, and I have had quite a few. He is also the last dog I will have, since I have been physically unable to take care of a dog as needed. I cannot expect my caretaker to take on a new dog after having had to not only walk my BG, but also diaper the poor thing in these last few months. I will definitely be the poorer for having to be without a dog. Begging everyone to forgive my splits!

Philip Spiess

Ira!     Funny that tonight you should mention the Seelbach Hotel (my favorite Louisville hotel, because of its Rookwood Room in the basement) -- I happen to be drinking a Seelbach Cocktail, which was created at the Seelbach Hotel in 1917, so it's a pre-Prohibition cocktail, which puts it in a league of its own.  (It is often claimed that the Old-Fashioned cocktail, possibly the oldest cocktail around, was created at the Pendennis Club in Louisville, but this is not true; however, the Pendennis Cocktail, a very respectable drink, was created there.)  The recipe for the Seelbach Cocktail was lost during Prohibition, and it was only rediscovered by the hotel's restaurant director in 1995, who served the cocktail but kept the recipe secret.  Finally the hotel released the recipe for publication in 1997.  [P.S.:  J. Graham Brown, of Louisville's Brown Hotel, built the Brown Student Center at Hanover College in Indiana, my alma mater and that of seven of your other Walnut Hills classmates; it opened in the Fall of 1967, just in time for our senior year.]  

Larry Klein

How joyous (tongue in cheek) that so many of my classmates remember the effective use of infinitives, or even the definition of infinitive.  I barely remember noun, verb, adjective, and adverb.  Parsing was never one of my favorite activities.  However, in honor of  the class of '64, henceforth, when playing golf, I shall name each of the fairways "Infinitive - One thru Eighteen" and subsequently resolve to "split" every single one of them.

Happy New Year 2019 to all and I hope you all are looking forward to reuning in 2021 as much as I am.

Philip Spiess

Larry:  "To Infinitive, and beyond!"

Judy Holtzer (Knopf)

Larry: 

"Reuning in 2021" . I love it!!!

I could barely believe my ears when an Israeli vet at the veterinary hospital treating my very sick 16 year old dog used - and pronounced - correctly the word "exacerbate". I must say that I was impressed at this from a vet. I would have been impressed to hear this from an M.D. here in Israel, even though most speak an acceptable English. 

Do you (with pets) think you would hear the word exacerbate from your vet? Just curious, George. 

Stephen Collett

Does anyone have experience in getting a DNA profile? Like sending in your stuff and getting a history of your DNA? Any advice appreciated.

Jerry Ochs

Jeff Daum

Hi Stephen, while I have not used any of the 'DNA profile' kits, my wife did the 23 & Me one about a three years ago.  Her interest were basically in verifying heritage and in the data on predisposition to certain illnesses.  The predisposition element is one that many individuals apparently do not want to know, from what I understand.  At any rate, she found the heritage basically confirming what she knew, and continues to get information from them as they increase their data base on predisposition issues.

This year she just completed the Ancestery DNA kit, because she is interested in finding any additional/closer relatives.  Her logic is that most people only do one or the other (they are the two largest services currently), and hence, may find a relative on one that is not on the other.

Bottom line, she has been satified with the reports and level of details.

Dale Gieringer

Steve -  I took a 23 and Me DNA test and am glad I did.  Though it didn’t identify any peculiar genetic conditions of medical concern, which was a relief, and merely confirmed my Northern European ethnic  origins, which I was already quite aware of, it put me in contact with a number of second cousins and other distant relatives of whom I had lost track or never been aware.  My wife even discovered that she had a half-cousin by a previously unknown illegitimate child of her grandfather or maybe great uncle.  Great fun for genealogy and family history buffs like me.

Barbara Kahn (Tepper)

My sister has been doing geneaology researxh on her husband's family as well as ours so I asked her if she wanted the Ancestry kit for Christmas. She was excited and asked me to do it too. We are waiting for our results now.  

Bonnie Altman (Templeton)

ATo those of you who are interested in DNA testing:  once you give your DNA, it becomes part of the public record  It is not private 

Chuck Cole

Public DNA databases have been in the news because they helped to solve serious unsolved crimes.  Neither 23 and me, nor Ancestry.com shares any data with the public databases.  I'm not sure where the public databases get their data, although there are some where you can agree to have your data added to it.  And in some public databases, the data is there but not linked to individual's identities.  Of course, just because the company says it will keep your data private doesn't mean that someone couldn't hack the site and steal the data.  

This is what 23 and me has to say about this:

23andMe will not sell, lease, or rent your individual-level information to any third party or to a third party for research purposes without your explicit consent. We do not share customer data with any public databases. We will not provide any person's data (genetic or non-genetic) to an insurance company or employer.

Stephen (Steve) Dixon

I am enjoying the grammar discussion. It is nice to feel less like a lone wolf, howling in the night. (Full disclosure: I went back and edited out a split infinitive there.)

On another note, check this out from The Onion.

https://www.theonion.com/report-students-who-take-latin-have-better-chance-of-s-1829686631?utm_campaign=SF&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_content=Main&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR1RZboGiFZj-h19v74Jh1A-d25cUx9egMKhO-OxMku6gv9VKVR9DtpITsw

Stephen (Steve) Dixon

To Steve Collett:

I sent my DNA sample to one of those services. Partly out of mild curiosity but also in the vague hope of finding some heretofore unknown link to a Native American, or a Pacific Islander. Something other than the tree full of Scots, Irish and English in family data compiled by an extremely sharp great aunt back in the 1950's & 60's.

But, alas, it was not to be. A bit of Scandinavian (no doubt an adventurous Viking), a German here or there. Otherwise, all British Isles with a major in Scotland and a minor in Ireland. Still, it was pretty interesting to see the data all beautifully organized and presented with geographical illustrations. And I did discover a few new limbs and branches.

Moreover, I made a connection with some folks pretty closely-related who had done some nice work and had pictures to share of people whose names I knew but had never seen a likeness of.

Philip Spiess

All of this DNA meterial reminds me of an old joke (as what does not?):

How do you tell a male chromosome from a female chromosome?  Pull down their genes!

Ann Shepard (Rueve)

I'm very late to the most recent discussions but would like to contribute a few thoughts:

1.  My grammar pet peeve is the forgotten use of the gerund and modifiers.  Many media anchors and hosts thank their listeners or viewers by saying, " I appreciate you listening to our show today" rather than, " I appreciate your listening to our show today".  UGH!!

2. My late husband was born and raised in Louisville, a graduate of St. X High School, and SPEED School of Engineering at U of L. He regularly complimented me on my preparation of one of his favorite dishes, Kentucky Hot Brown, created at the Brown Hotel.

3.  Judy, I'm so glad your 16 year old puppy is hanging in there.  I volunteer with an amazing group of people, angels on this earth, who help to provide care for ill or elderly pets.  Angel's Paws, was modeled after human hospice, and provides 24/7 in home care and treatment.  In 2018, Angel's Paws helped over 1100 pets improve the quality of their remaining time and provided support services for the humans who love them.  

4. Several weeks ago, a twice removed first cousin contacted me.  She had taken an Ancestry DNA test a couple of years ago.  She said a young man, identified by the test as her 3rd cousin, had contacted her.  He wanted to know if she was familiar with the name of a man whom he believed to be the father he had been trying to find for 48 years. 

I contacted my brother, who was a career Air Force and stationed all over the world from 1960 to 1984.  Long story short , he vaguely remembered brief dalliance with and older (married) woman when he was briefly stationed in San Antonio, Texas prior to being stationed in the Philippines in 1970.  After the initial shock, not only did my brother contact  the young man, Mike, he welcomed him.  My brother's other five children also embraced him and have been in constant contact since shortly before Christmas.  My brother's eldest son, Buddy, age 52,  told Mike that even though he has a new brother, he still holds the title of "first born". 

My brother and I have taken our Ancestry tests now and waiting for results.  We have a maternal first cousin who had done an extensive genealogy search on our maternal side, finding our grandfather's father and our grandmother's parents, into the 1700s, during slavery.  We even have roots in Ireland, Scotland, and England. We have little information on our paternal side, as our father was an orphan.  It will be interesting to see what information we will be able to gather. 

Jerry Ochs

More language abuse:  Our sons attended an international school (K-12) and the teachers were from many different countries.  Some of the young teachers from the U.S.A. used "myself" in place of "me" in such sentences as, "If you have any questions, please contact the headmaster or myself".  They also too often used "that" in place of "who". 
 

Jerry Ochs

TIL about MIMAL, the elf formed by the outlines of five states on the west bank of the Mississippi River.

Philip Spiess

Jerry:  Your map just shows how language gets muddled over time:  Originally, it was not the Gulf of Mexico, it was the Elf of Mexico.  Some scholars insist it was the Gandulf of Mexico, which got contracted over time to Gulf, as has happened to so many words and phrases in our language, for instance, "By Golly, you mean -- ?" which has been contracted to "By Gum!"  (The word "Golly!" itself is, no doubt, a contraction of "Gollum.")  I forget who signed the actual contract.

Judy Holtzer (Knopf)

Dear Ann - You are an amazing person. I was so pleased to hear of Angel's Paws, a most fitting venue for your talent and passion for pets. It is a wonderful idea. Could I write to you privately sometime?

Dale Gieringer

Steve -   My family all sent DNA samples to 23andMe.   We didn't learn much about our family origins - I already knew I'm German/British Northern European, though it was interesting to learn that I had a touch of ancient Neanderthal.  Neither did we discover any genetic predispositions to one horrible disease or another, thank goodness.  However, I did make contact with a number of DNA relatives, including some second and third cousins whom I'd forgotten about or was unaware of.   Great fun for genealogy buffs like myself.  Also, my wife discovered that she had a half-cousin  through  a previously unknown  illegitimate liaison involving  her grandfather or great-uncle.   An intriguing family mystery to explore. 

David Buchholz

I sent in my DNA and discovered pretty much what I already suspected—that my ancestors were mostly from Western Europe.  My American born Chinese wife discovered that she was Chinese, (duh) 98% Han Chinese in fact, but was surprised 26 years ago when we stepped off our plane in Beijing that by looking at her face the customs inspector told her exactly what part of China she had come from.  Two more episodes of people sending in their DNA.  Vanity Fair recounted a story of a woman who discovered that the surprises in her DNA led her to investigate further, discovering in her research that her grandfather and another person had been switched as babies in a maternity ward.  These services do warn you that you might find a surprise or two.  The second episode is closer to home.  My wife's cousin and his wife are both forensic scientists.  Mary Hong, the cousin's wife, put two and two together last year and discovered through one of the DNA databases that the DNA of Joseph DeAngelo, who is better known in California as the "Golden State Killer", a 73 year old man accused of more than thirteen murders and fifty rapes, was living peacefully in Sacramento, having given up his life of crime many years ago.  The DNA had been saved from the thirteen murders and was one and the same.  When DeAngelo was identified detectives picked out a cup from his garbage and matched it to the DNA from the murders.  Perfect match.  They returned and took something else from his garbage.  Again, a perfect match.  When they arrested him last year he told the arresting officers, "There's a roast in the oven."  Love that.  And as a footnote, my son is a Sacramento Public Defender.  His supervisor is DeAngelo's attorney.

Paul Simons

I don't have any DNA info but I do have a gripe about current arbitrary, unnecessary contortions forced onto our language. When did "Ask" become a noun? I hear politicians saying things like "This is a one-time ask and it will be used to promote peace, love, and nutritous breakfasts for our brave First Responders". And why did ask get replaced by axe in a large swath of our population as in "I didn't axe him why he committed the axe murder but if you can meet my axe of $20.00 I will axe him in the next debate"? What the heck is going on?

Philip Spiess

You axe me no questions, I'll fell you no lies (and an axe of $20 for an axe is -- the world, by the way, turns on an axe is -- no doubt, cut-rate).

Paul Simons